1997 K3500 4X4 Dually Front Brakes Questions!

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wirlybird

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My half ich drive torque wrench is too fat at the end to fit good.
Ordered a set of metric flair style crows foot. Hope that works ok. Tried to get a 21mm X 1/2 inch drive torque adapter but every one I found will take several days to get here!
Only other option at the moment is to use my 1/2 inch drive Matco swivel head ratchet with 2 foot handle and just crank them down! It has a very slim head and fits perfect.
 

wirlybird

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Ok upon further examination we may be in business. With the wrench in this position we have plenty of room and even at a 90 to this it is still pretty square on the nut so I think we will be ok.
Got to go brush hog a field so will try this later.

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Schurkey

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There was a good video about torque specs on the youtube channel below...
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'Bout the only thing that really surprised me was the correction factor for anti-seize.

They're showing that the applied force is almost exactly double what the tool is adjusted for. I've always dialed-down my torque adjustment by 20%, and--apparently--I should have been using 50%.

I'm thinking that a couple of years ago when I last checked, the Permatex (or was it Loctite?) web site had torque correction factors for their various formulas of anti-seize, and they were along the lines of 10%--25% depending on the anti-seize formula. (Copper vs. Aluminum vs. Nickel)

Researching it right now, the "Permatex Training" web site says (lawyer talk, lawyer talk, disclaimers, disclaimers...) 20--30% reduction in torque-wrench setting.

But the actual product fact-sheets call for "normal torque values" when assembling, which is JUST CRAZY. I think that part was written by lawyers who are too scared to change torque settings from what the manufacturer of the assembly is calling for.
Permatex aluminum-based anti-seize:
www.permatex.com/wp-content/uploads/tds/80078.pdf

Permatex copper-based anti-seize:
www.permatex.com/wp-content/uploads/tds/09128.pdf

Loctite is much the same. They tell you to "tighten with hand tools to proper torque requirement." in the C5A (copper) anti-seize web page.
www.henkel-adhesives.com/us/en/product/anti-seize-lubricants/loctite_lb_8008_c5-a/_jcr_content.html

OTOH, they give you a torque coefficient for their marine-grade anti-seize, and the math formula for figuring out the torque adjustment:

The relationship between torque and
clamp load is expressed in the following equation:
T = K x F x D
T = Torque (N·m, lb.in, lb.ft)
K = Torque coefficient or nut factor, determine experimentally
F = Clamp load (N, lb.)
D = Nominal diameter of bolt (mm, in.)
Torque coefficient, k:
3/8 x 16 steel nuts and bolts 0.18
But they're not so helpful with their other grades of anti-seize; either providing different torque coefficients, or saying nothing at all about torque.

SO: You can't trust the anti-seize manufacturer to provide much help in the torque-adjustment field; and since a 20% adjustment has been working for me fairly well for thirty years, that's what I'm going with.
 

Schurkey

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^^^ Bostik Never-Seez has a different take on torque values; including applying anti-seize to the underside of the bolt head which is all-new to me.
The use of Never-Seez Regular Grade requires about 30% less torque while providing the same clamping force on threads. Never-Seez Pure Nickel reduces torque by 15%, and Mariner’s Choice requires 41% less torque. This torque percentage is even lower if Never-Seez is applied to both the threads and bolt cap, which is the preferred method.
But then they totally fail to tell us how much to reduce the torque applied when the bolt-head is coated.
 

wirlybird

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I wonder if there is a reduction percent for something like blue Permatex thread lock?

I don't know why I am fussing with the torque wrench anyway on this. No one seems to know what the torque spec is for these bolts! Best I have found is one video suggested 140 Lbs like the lug nuts for lack of any other info!

What also surprises me is the nuts do not appear to be any type of lock nut nor is there any lock washer.
I guess the hope is you get them tight enough that they won't eventually back off.
I know when I removed the wheel spaces it took little effort to loosen the nuts.
 

Caman96

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No one seems to know what the torque spec is for these bolts!
I’m seeing a lot saying they just match what lug nut torque is.

Hub nut (1995) 180ftlbs
Drive axle mounting flange bolts 59 ftlbs
Hub and bearing assembly-to-steering knuckle (92 and later) 133 ftlbs (almost 140, so mamz was kinda right) :p:

As for the lug nuts:
5 and 6 lug 1500's and 2500's 100ftlbs
8 lug 2500's and SRW 3500's 120ftlbs
And lastly the DRW 3500's get 140ftlbs”
^^^From another forum.
 

wirlybird

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I’m seeing a lot saying they just match what lug nut torque is.

Hub nut (1995) 180ftlbs
Drive axle mounting flange bolts 59 ftlbs
Hub and bearing assembly-to-steering knuckle (92 and later) 133 ftlbs (almost 140, so mamz was kinda right) :p:

As for the lug nuts:
5 and 6 lug 1500's and 2500's 100ftlbs
8 lug 2500's and SRW 3500's 120ftlbs
And lastly the DRW 3500's get 140ftlbs”
^^^From another forum.
What I got out of the '97 service manual is the 4 bolts for the hub are 133 and the large nut on the splined half shaft is 165 and dually rims are 140.
I haven't found anything for the 8 nuts that hold on the wheel adapter!

This is the only thing I have found and it is in the '98 service manual. Not even sure if it is the right thing.

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smdk2500

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I'm curious to know as well. I need to do front hub bearings on my 99 and will have the joys of removing and reinstalling the hub adaptors.
 
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